great to hear it.

I’m really looking forward to see new release with (hopefully) some more docs/tutorial_apps to start playing with Turbinado hoping to fullfill my web needs in Haskell instead of going to Django.

As it was mentioned in the comment(s) above, I like Turbinado’s “not nearly as innovative”-ness and I’m sure with (more) support for shared-hosting it can become reall killer-app with fast-growing community…

All the best!

Sincerely, Gour

I’ve already started stealing Michael’s code (a hideous reword of some of his lovely code is here), so I just need to get StaticRoutes done. Then I’ll plead the case to Michael.

it would be great if you join the forces to make one complete Haskel web framework for ‘unwashed masses of scripting languages’

All the best, Gour

Thanks for the pointer on Merb “provides”. I’ve been trying to figure out how to do something similar with Turbinado. My inclination is to find automatically the proper View. So Abba/Ding -> Views/Abba/Ding.hs, Abba/Ding.xml -> Views/Abba/Ding.xml.hs, etc. Probably clearLayout if a format is specified… Would that be a good solution?

Michael,

Dynamic recompilation isn’t only a dev feature. Or I assume that it isn’t since Rails and ASP.NET both provide for dynamic recompilation in production settings. That said, like ASP.NET, Turbinado can be darned slow to start up.

The biggest issue I see with going to static Controller/Views is figuring out Cs/Vs exist at compile-time. Seems as though the most straightforward way to do this is to create a StaticDispatcher and a DynamicDispatcher. If Config/App.hs says to use the StaticDispatcher, then your StaticRoutes.hs will be used to build the CodeStore.

This actually might not be so difficult. At startup, a addStaticRoutes filter could be run to build a CodeStore from Config/StaticRoutes.hs; at runtime, the CodeStore could check the DynamicDispatch flag to determine whether it should look around for Cs/Vs or just use what’s in the CodeStore. If you have more than 10-15 Cs/Vs (or Components), this route could get really painful…

I’ve just finished up Cookies and want to do CookieSessions (for authentication) then. That’ll comprise V0.5. I’ll ping you thereafter to see if you’re really game to contribute to Turbinado if I add a StaticDispatch option.

I wouldn’t be offended at someone saying Turbinado is “not nearly as innovative.” I think Happs is too innovative, in the sense that it needlessly reinvents wheels. Relational databases are pretty well established at this point, and I think building on top of them is a Good Thing.

Also, thank you for taking a look at some of my ideas on Yesod. As others here have said, I think you should reconsider the decision to not build in support for CGI. Sure, dynamic recompilation is nice, but to me it sounds like a great development feature, whereas a fully compiled CGI executable sounds like a reasonable deployment version.

Providing those two alternate paths, I believe, would be the best of both worlds: the kind of rapid development hitherto known only to the unwashed masses of scripting languages , along with the power of Haskell.

Definitely let me know if you have a change of heart on this topic, you’ll at least gain a lot more interest from me. In fact, I’d probably drop my framework attempt and join yours, since I otherwise like your approaches.

Michael

The place where I have trouble thinking about the right kind of Haskell-iness is in producing HTML or other output. Achieving something like the “provides” of Merb is where we should aim, and it’s probably a good application for Haskell’s type system.

To be fair, the only things that work on shared hosting in that scheme are PHP, Perl, etc. — straight CGI. You can get that from Haskell with the CGI libraries.

Rails and its ilk are not suitable for bare bones shared hosting because of their resource requirements.

I’m not writing comercial web apps, I just want to use Haskell to write some basic crap for me and some friends – $10 a month would be more than I would be prepared to pay for something like that. In comparison I’ve had my nfs site for about a year now, and I’ve only paid $5 so far.

Anyway, the point is that the cheapest VPS is two orders of magnitude more expensive than the cheapest shared hosting, so if you truly want a web app for the masses, it needs to work on shared hosting.

VPSs can be had for around $20/m (about twice as much as a shared host), so for a bit more you gain a ton of flexibility (for Django, too).

Paul,

Yes, the blog is on WordPress, because Turbinado wasn’t mature enough to build a blog on. It will be mature enough in a few weeks time, though I’m not sure a blog would be my initial target…

On HAML, I’ve been putting a bit of time into it here and there. The biggest problem I have is that I need to figure out how to support XML and HAML simultaneously. That’s occupying the majority of my time. I think that I’ll wind up modifying the “trhsx” translator to handle HAML… and that frightens me…

Also, could you tell me more about what is the right amount of Haskell-iness? I think I kinda feel the same way. With Turbinado, I’m trying to provide all that really helpful stuff from Rails without crushing the Haskell-iness, but I’m not sure that I’m hitting the mark…

Well, that’s OK and it leaves us with the hope that Yesod will make it.

I can get a ‘shared’ hosting for Django for 4€/m, and it would be great to have Django-like framework for hacking in Haskell.